Final Fantasy 13: Fabula Nova Crys- ah, whatever.

[grimey]

So spoilers for this game have been posted online.  I won't reveal anything about the plot, but here are some things to consider:

No side-quests.  Extremely linear gameplay throughout the entire first half of the game.
The skill tree is a carbon copy of Final Fantasy 10.
Cid is a super effeminate, metrosexual manboy that looks like he stepped out of a Japanese host club.
No fanfare at end of battle.
HP recovered after EACH encounter.
Game is linear, one secret boss
Characters are cliche throughout whole game

The staff are the team who made FFX-2
The status screen shows only "attack" and "magic attack"
You can only use one character in battle

[namestolen]

sounds like GOTY material to me

[megabadd]

I pretty much tried for as long as possible to not learn anything about or see anything relating to FF13... unless this thread. All that sounds not so great ('cept the carbon copy sphere system, and that it was designed by the X-2 team, which I enjoyed). Oh well, I'm sure I'll love it anyway. I should have it in two weeks.

[Erik]

To be fair a lot of that stuff is true in 10 as well, and 10 is probs my favorite Final Fantasy.  Not to open up that discussion or anything, just saying.

Thinking about getting a PS3 just to play 13 now, but... I have a lot of game (Fallout) to play as is so I think I'm just gonna wait and import it when it comes out for Xbox stateside.

How is that for irony.

[Lazzie]

This is a little discouraging, but I'll wait for reviews and more reliable word of mouth before I pass judgment.  I can't simply ignore FF XIII news anymore now that I have the system to play it.  

EDIT: I've checked around here and a few other places, and I think that these spoilers are in some ways inaccurate, or at least incomplete and biased.  There are a ton of screenshots showing a party of multiple characters, for one. 

[grimey]

A digest of criticism from 2ch:
-The whole game is completely linear until halfway through [approximately 20 hours].
-There are hardly any towns.
-The party is always fixed. The whole game just repeats the movie-battle sequence over and over [In fact the progression is closer to movie-run-battle-run-movie-boss-movie-run-battle…].
-There are rather a lot of movies.
-Moving around is like a long marathon.
-The whole game system is just a clone of FF10.
-You can't flee battles [You can't avoid most battles either as there is no sneaking past enemies, including weak ones].
-Your party is completely healed after each battle.
-If the main character in your party dies it is game over [There are only ever 3 characters in battle, often less, and often fixed].
-The best tactic is almost always endlessly attacking. There is next to no strategy or skill involved.
-The summons' transformation scenes are a joke [i.e. Odin turning into a horse].
-The story is rubbish… [Spoilers omitted, but complaints centre on Snow's constant and cringe inducing insistence that he is a hero and will "protect" whatever it is the antagonists are menacing this time]
-Shopping is only done at "online" shops on save points, with no proper shops to be found.
-However, this doesn't matter as you hardly ever get any money [and you can never buy anything more powerful than what you already looted].
-There have been next to no changes from the demo.
-The status screen displays no real information.
-There are only 8 items usable in combat [For that matter, there are hardly any weapons or accessories, and the "crafting" system mostly consists of spending drops to upgrade their 2 stats].
-There are no levels.
-With all their advertising money, just how was it they failed even to get Famitsu to give full points?

[megabadd]

Hmm, sounds like they are taking FF10 (my favorite FF) and mashing it together with FF8 (my least favorite FF). This worries me.

Although the lack of options should mean till will be easier to play in Japanese.

[namestolen]

What ever happened to being skeptical?

Am I the only person here that thinks this sounds like utter crap? Final Fantasy has only meant one thing and one thing only to me: high production values that sometimes accompany a really solid RPG. However, all these criticisms seem like FFXIII will be a BAD game despite the high production values and name recognition that will still move quite a few copies.

As long as the new features can somehow line up to make combat a satisfying experience (beyond looking cool), I'm sure this game will be tolerable, but everything Matt has posted sounds like this game will be a best-selling disaster.

[grimey]

My one disclaimer is that I've read some people insist that the game is legitimately difficult and you can't just attack over and over without any strategy.  Besides that, many people that have played the game have confirmed the stuff in that list.

[Erik]

What ever happened to being skeptical?

Am I the only person here that thinks this sounds like utter crap? Final Fantasy has only meant one thing and one thing only to me: high production values that sometimes accompany a really solid RPG. However, all these criticisms seem like FFXIII will be a BAD game despite the high production values and name recognition that will still move quite a few copies.

As long as the new features can somehow line up to make combat a satisfying experience (beyond looking cool), I'm sure this game will be tolerable, but everything Matt has posted sounds like this game will be a best-selling disaster.

Well, I didn't read Matt's second post -like Chris I'm trying to keep myself in the dark as much as possible - so I dunno about that, but basically "A digest of criticism from 2ch" is not something I use to dictate my tastes.  Famitsu gave it a 39/40, so at least someone must like it.

Fact is I know nothing about FFXIII and plan to stay that way 'til it's in my drive.  I've enjoyed every Final Fantasy ever made ever and have no real reason to believe XIII will be that big of a change.

And, if it truly is abyssmal, then I wanna play it anyway, just to see for myself how the behemoth finally went down.

[grimey]

The peculiar thing about Final Fantasy is that it's one of the few franchises left that the masses will go out and buy regardless of how good or bad the hype is.  I guarantee that most people will go out and buy it in spite of the badmouthing.  Even the fanboys and girls that are whining "Final Fantasy is dead" will play it because deep down they either want to be proven wrong or they want to say "I told you so" and act just a tiny bit smug.

Square Enix won't catch a break with their flagship series.  Many (Japanese) gamers didn't like the nonlinearity of FFXII.  SE tried to drastically switch up the formula with that title but it didn't sell as well as many expected.  This return to tradition will be seen as a step back to the people that actually liked the freedom of FFXII.  On the other hand, there are plenty of people that appreciate being railroaded through a plot as long as the battle system and characters are interesting.

As for Famitsu, I can't really support a fair number of their 39/40 or 40/40 games.  The readers of Famitsu are so biased towards RPGs and specifically Final Fantasy that it's difficult to trust the objectivity of its reviewers.

In March 2006 Japanese Famitsū magazine readers voted on their 100 all-time favorite games. (Full list). The top ten games picked by fans were:
Final Fantasy X (2001)
Final Fantasy VII (1997)
Dragon Quest III (1988)
Dragon Quest VIII (2004)
Machi (1998)
Final Fantasy IV (1991)
Tactics Ogre (1995)
Final Fantasy III (1990)
Dragon Quest VII (2000)
The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time (1998)

[Erik]

As for Famitsu, I can't really support a fair number of their 39/40 or 40/40 games.  The readers of Famitsu are so biased towards RPGs and specifically Final Fantasy that it's difficult to trust the objectivity of its reviewers.

Oh, I'm not trying to put Famitsu on a pedastal or anything.  They're wrong as often as anyone else.  But if we're talking about the legitimacy of opinions, the louder posters on 2ch are hardly any better.  I'm just saying, not everyone's hating.

I agree with what you say about the sales arc of Final Fantasy series in general.  Even if they do lose it someday I'll probably keep buying them for a long time...

I didn't like XII much at all, even though I think that everything else notwithstanding freedom is always better than linearity.  X is definitely a railroad, but it is a railroad I enjoyed, so hopefully I'll find something to love in FFXIII too.

[megabadd]

As for Famitsu, I can't really support a fair number of their 39/40 or 40/40 games.  The readers of Famitsu are so biased towards RPGs and specifically Final Fantasy that it's difficult to trust the objectivity of its reviewers.

Oh, I'm not trying to put Famitsu on a pedastal or anything.  They're wrong as often as anyone else.  But if we're talking about the legitimacy of opinions, the louder posters on 2ch are hardly any better.  I'm just saying, not everyone's hating.

I agree with what you say about the sales arc of Final Fantasy series in general.  Even if they do lose it someday I'll probably keep buying them for a long time...

I didn't like XII much at all, even though I think that everything else notwithstanding freedom is always better than linearity.  X is definitely a railroad, but it is a railroad I enjoyed, so hopefully I'll find something to love in FFXIII too.

While not totally on topic, I really enjoy linearity with a couple of dashes of well thought out side quests that work to bolster the main story. I was not a fan of how X and XII handled optional quests, but I can see 100%-ers loving them. The only game that has ever done side quests correctly (for me) has been Chrono Trigger - where I actually really wanted to do the side-quests because they had an effect on the story and gave neat gear.

[namestolen]

Right... when you have two positions on radically opposite sides of one another, it probably means that both are a little right, but both can't entirely be trusted. I just felt I needed to keep some form of check on the thread since the only replies to the criticisms posted seemed to be cast aside in favor of "hey, those Final Fantasy games ain't bad, so this one won't be either," which is a statement I can't get behind personally.

[goddesswing]

I just generally like bad games, so.....

[~Stephen~]

I think the game will look great and tho I'm a FF novice in terms of the amount I've played, I'm probably sure I'll enjoy. I was a BIG FAN of XII but not for the freedom but the actual gameplay/story/look-feel/and fixings. Even if this is a little more LINEAR, I think I'll still carve out enjoyment from it.

[ExMachina]

1up's RPG Blog has some positive impressions about FF13!

http://www.1up.com/do/blogEntry?bId=9013668

I have no issues with linearity - JRPGs tend to do choice/branching storylines and world-building somewhat poorly compared to WRPGs anyways, so the rigidity is often welcome.

[megabadd]

Gleamings at one hour in (MILD SPOILERS):




-Lightening is badass and will defy gravity at every opportunity.
-Sahz (sp?) is comic relief, but not annoying (yet).
-Battles are fast-paced and action packed, though a little confusing atm (ATB).
-You get graded out of 5 stars on your performance in battles, which I'm guessing determines items.

[megabadd]

6 hours in or so (MILD SPOILERS):

-The characters are kinda annoying (so far). The only one I really like his Sahz (sp?) as he seems to be the only 'balanced' one, and I kinda like Lightning -- the others just get on my nerves. To recap, Sahz is a more comedic Auron type, Lightning is the Cloud/Squall badass mashup, Snow is the Tidus/Zidane annoying save-everyone mashup, Vanilla is the Selphie/Rikku encourage-everyone-annoyingly mashup, and Hope is a Vivi like character with similar problems on self confindence (but more annoying).

-Save points EVERYWHERE. I take about two steps and BAM, save point. Kinda useless too, since there is a retry option if you die in battle.

-I like the battle system (as it gets a bit more complicated every hour with new mechanics being thrown in), but it seems like they were going for a system like Star Ocean (but then neglected the free moving). Things happen pretty quickly so you have to really be paying attention in the bigger battles.

-No levels, only CP you get from each fight that you can use on your crystal grid (which you don't get until hour 4-5 because of story reasons).

-Japanese language wise, the game is pretty easy. If you didn't happen to understand some of the stuff the characters were explaining while they were saying it, or if you didn't understand a reference or any FMV that happens, and entry will pop up in your journal and you can read it at your own pace. For anyone with a good basis of kanji, I'd suggest s/he pick it up. The story so far is pretty good. Lots of drama and mysteries. Plot wise, things are happening much more quickly than most other FFs. For eg, 5 of the main playable characters already meet up by hour 3.

[megabadd]

I’m about 12 hours into FFXIII now. The character development is starting to kick in (story wise and gameplay wise) and I finally understand the battle, shop and crafting elements (I thought the game was pretty mediocre until I figured out some key things like job shifting will refill my ATB guage). I really do love the game now, but it did take some time to grow on me. Load times are almost non-existent. It’s quick paced and absolutely visually stunning. The world never cease to amaze with the level of detail. The graphics are jaw dropping and the facial expressions are amazing.

[~Stephen~]

Anyone else playing besides me and Amanda (and obvi Chris from a ways ago). I'll post my thoughts here in a bit but I'm reallllly enjoying the game so far.

[Bobby]

Anyone else playing besides me and Amanda (and obvi Chris from a ways ago). I'll post my thoughts here in a bit but I'm reallllly enjoying the game so far.

J's playing, but he hates you all so he will never post on the forums.

[ajnrules]

J's playing, but he hates you all so he will never post on the forums.

 

[J]

Anyone else playing besides me and Amanda (and obvi Chris from a ways ago). I'll post my thoughts here in a bit but I'm reallllly enjoying the game so far.

J's playing, but he hates you all so he will never post on the forums.

Bobby spreads only LIES! LIES I tell you! Nothing but only love for the fellow gamers, despite my infrequent posts.

I've been playing the 360 version of the game, and so far I have completed chapters 1-3. About 4-5 hours in I really enjoy what I've seen. It's evident from both the leveling up system and level design that this is the same team that made FFX, which isn't neccesarily a bad thing. I honestly don't agree AT ALL with reviews complaining about the slow beginning - it's slower to ramp up than other modern games, I suppose, but it's completely on par with the pacing of other FF games, IMO.

I'll have more to say when I play more - I hope to sink some good time in the game this weekend.

I did want to address the 360 version in particular, though. I do not own a PS3 so I cannot do a direct comparison, and everything I've read online leads me to believe that if one has a choice, the PS3 version is the way to go (if only for higher-res cutscenes). That said, I have no complaints whatsoever with the 360 version. Load times are fast, game looks and plays extremely well, as do the cutscenes. I'm on a 32" 720p tv, so any loss of resolution may be more noticeable on a larger TV. In summary - if you only have a 360, you won't be wasting your money buying the game on this platform, based on what I've seen so far.

Stephen and Amanda - I'd love to hear your (spoiler free) thoughts!!!

Bobby - Take that! I posted!

[ExMachina]

Taking a break from playing the game because some friends commandeered the screen for Pacquiao vs Clottey. xD Typing during the undercard / between rounds.

I'm some 15+ hours in and just got past chapter 10 (the previous chapter was all kinda of crazy awesome, btw).

I definitely agree with J that the complaints about a slow beginning are greatly exaggerated; it's really about the same when compared to past FFs'. The first few chapters aren't exactly riveting gameplay-wise since they take their time in opening up all of the battle system options, but it works as an intro/tutorial that makes sense plot-wise and is necessary for easing you into the rather complicated combat. There's plenty to enjoy visually from the start though - the characters are your typical Nomura designs, but the environments are downright ridiculous.

Lemme talk about the battle system, because it is by far the strongest part of the game. There's no MP, you regain full HP after every battle, and you can retry any battle you fail. This works in FF13 because the battles are damn hard - the constant casting of magic attacks, healing, and buff/debuffs are all necessary for dealing with even lowly mobs.

Instead of micromanaging all of your characters' actions, you only control the leader directly, and even so you'll probably be hitting the Auto Battle option most of the time (chooses the best actions available to your current Role depending on whether you've scanned for enemy weaknesses, the status of your party, etc.). The strategy comes from switching Paradigms - you change the Roles (equivalent of Jobs or Dresspheres) of all 3 of your party members at once. There's a bit of a time penalty in the form of a flashy animation, but your ATB gauge starts out full after a Paradigm Shift, so it's actually faster to constantly switch between sets every time. It ends up setting a quick rhythm to combat in the game, especially since you have to constantly pressure in order to build up chain combos to stagger and actually do damage.

The entire system encourages speed here - make your decisions quickly, overwhelm the enemies before they can overwhelm you, and then get rated for how quickly/well you fought. By far the most compelling reason to continue through the game, IMO, is the combat system and the awesome boss fights.

RE: the linearity...

The game forces you into playing specific 2 or 3-man groups for a good 12 or so hours, which is certainly frustrating from a customization / party build perspective, but again it helps you learn the ins and outs of all the Roles and possible Paradigms. The plot and environment design do both work to constantly push you forward (thus, the comments that FF13 = "pretty tunnels"). But playing as smaller groups emphasizes character interaction and development, and I've actually ended up liking all of the party members (note: this did take the full 15 hours to happen though, haha) when I was pretty iffy on everyone being anime stereotypes initially.

Eventually, the game does open up and allow you full control over your party members and character builds, which kinda reminds me of FF6j's change from the World of Balance to World of Ruin, actually...

The plot and characters are comparable to previous FFs' - just come equipped with a healthy tolerance for anime types and logic, and you'll probably enjoy the setting and narrative.

I'm playing the PS3 version, so here are some technical notes: The mix of in-game cutscenes and rendered FMVs give that "Star Wars" fix that you've probably come to expect since FF7, FFX, and FF12. I hear that the overall experience is pretty much intact on the 360, but I've gotta say the level of technical prowess in the PS3 version is unrivaled - the engine-rendered portions of the game are native 720p, but the PS3 automatically upscales cleanly to full 1080p and all the FMV cutscenes are full 1080p - meaning Blu-Ray quality.

Sound mix doesn't match up to the quality of the video though - the soundtrack itself is great and the voice actors are all solid, but there's an issue with dialogue levels being mixed too low (solved easily with subtitles enabled, I guess). Kind of a shame after playing games like Uncharted 2 which have perfect surround mixes, but oh well.

Huh! That ended up being a giant block of text. Boo to losing an hour to the time switch.